Here are some of my experiences with the various g+ alternatives that I found worth sharing, so maybe they are...
Here are some of my experiences with the various g+ alternatives that I found worth sharing, so maybe they are useful for someone else, too.
All of them are of course different from how they work and what their business model is.
■ business model, "sustainability"
MeWe is commercially operated, and they promise to respect and defend your privacy. That's nice. But there is no guarantee this could not change anytime, for example when they are get bought up by some "big player" once they have reached a critical mass (just remember what has happened to WhatsApp).
And once you've reached a certain limit on data (think images and videos you may upload), it's not free any more and you have to pay for it. That said, I have to add that I have absolutely no issues to pay for something that's worth it.
You will see ads there, but they are not personally targeted, at least to what they say.
Their sources are closed source, so there's no way to find out what's going on behind the curtain.
Minds is commercially operated, too. As far as I understood their business model is based on "boosts". You publish content and if you want to see it spread all around their platform, you have to pay for it.
On the other hand, you can also make money if your content is liked and reshared a lot. The "currency" used internally is based on ethereum.
Their sources are open, so you can verify what's going on.
The open source "federated networks" such as Diaspora, Mastodon, Friendzilla and so on actually have no real "business model". They run because some people are willing to operate them in their free time. If you are in bad luck and the node/pod or whatever they call the server you are using to log into the network goes down for whatever reason, your data is lost.
■ data protection
You may have a good or bad opinion on EU data protection regulations, but nevertheless they are in effect to protect more than 550 million people living in the EU.
None of the alternatives I have tried, both the commercially and community operated ones, even remotely meet up to the requirements laid out in the current EU data protection laws.
Depending on the platform, you may or may not be able to download your personal data, some have absolutely no or insufficient information on the cookies they use and a lot of other things that I find really frightening.
If I had to choose one of the platforms solely based on how they handle privacy, I couldn't choose one.
■ eye candy and usability
Those are highly subjective things, of course.
My personal favorites here are MeWe and Minds. Nice and responsive design, performance has been decent. The open source alternatives are just "lacking", particularly when it comes to eye candy, to say at least.
Sometimes things like removing someone from your list contacts can be quite difficult in Disapora, for example, but if you use it regularly, you'll certainly learn to overcome the obstacles.
■ groups
MeWe clearly leads the way here, but minds isn't bad either. They have almost everything you can think of. You can moderate and ban for example. But both lack the ability to add group categories like we know from g+ or to pin posts.
Diaspora and the other "federated" are mainly based on tags. You post something and add one or more tags to it. At the same time you can "subscribe" to tags. So if someone publishes a post containing a tag you have subscribed to, you will see it in your "stream" or however they call it.
Some of them allow you to filter this a little bit more, for example only displaying content matching your subscribed tags and your contacts. Sounds nice, but if you think of conventional groups of 1000s of members like we have here on g+ or elsewhere, I don't think this will scale.
■ mobile use
All off the networks I've tried have official or unofficial mobile client applications (at least on Android).
But again, just like I said with eye candy and usability above, the commercial offerings in my opinion lead here.
And some of them (like pluspora) are quite usable without a dedicated app just by accessing them on a mobile browser.
■ the bottom line
All of this is based on my personal experience, so I might just be very very wrong about just everything :) ... if I am, please let me know, I'm more than willing to learn!
Unfortunately, based on what I've seen, I have not clue yet where I'll end up eventually.
What a stupid thing to give up g+ instead of seeing its potential and developing it into something great!
All of them are of course different from how they work and what their business model is.
■ business model, "sustainability"
MeWe is commercially operated, and they promise to respect and defend your privacy. That's nice. But there is no guarantee this could not change anytime, for example when they are get bought up by some "big player" once they have reached a critical mass (just remember what has happened to WhatsApp).
And once you've reached a certain limit on data (think images and videos you may upload), it's not free any more and you have to pay for it. That said, I have to add that I have absolutely no issues to pay for something that's worth it.
You will see ads there, but they are not personally targeted, at least to what they say.
Their sources are closed source, so there's no way to find out what's going on behind the curtain.
Minds is commercially operated, too. As far as I understood their business model is based on "boosts". You publish content and if you want to see it spread all around their platform, you have to pay for it.
On the other hand, you can also make money if your content is liked and reshared a lot. The "currency" used internally is based on ethereum.
Their sources are open, so you can verify what's going on.
The open source "federated networks" such as Diaspora, Mastodon, Friendzilla and so on actually have no real "business model". They run because some people are willing to operate them in their free time. If you are in bad luck and the node/pod or whatever they call the server you are using to log into the network goes down for whatever reason, your data is lost.
■ data protection
You may have a good or bad opinion on EU data protection regulations, but nevertheless they are in effect to protect more than 550 million people living in the EU.
None of the alternatives I have tried, both the commercially and community operated ones, even remotely meet up to the requirements laid out in the current EU data protection laws.
Depending on the platform, you may or may not be able to download your personal data, some have absolutely no or insufficient information on the cookies they use and a lot of other things that I find really frightening.
If I had to choose one of the platforms solely based on how they handle privacy, I couldn't choose one.
■ eye candy and usability
Those are highly subjective things, of course.
My personal favorites here are MeWe and Minds. Nice and responsive design, performance has been decent. The open source alternatives are just "lacking", particularly when it comes to eye candy, to say at least.
Sometimes things like removing someone from your list contacts can be quite difficult in Disapora, for example, but if you use it regularly, you'll certainly learn to overcome the obstacles.
■ groups
MeWe clearly leads the way here, but minds isn't bad either. They have almost everything you can think of. You can moderate and ban for example. But both lack the ability to add group categories like we know from g+ or to pin posts.
Diaspora and the other "federated" are mainly based on tags. You post something and add one or more tags to it. At the same time you can "subscribe" to tags. So if someone publishes a post containing a tag you have subscribed to, you will see it in your "stream" or however they call it.
Some of them allow you to filter this a little bit more, for example only displaying content matching your subscribed tags and your contacts. Sounds nice, but if you think of conventional groups of 1000s of members like we have here on g+ or elsewhere, I don't think this will scale.
■ mobile use
All off the networks I've tried have official or unofficial mobile client applications (at least on Android).
But again, just like I said with eye candy and usability above, the commercial offerings in my opinion lead here.
And some of them (like pluspora) are quite usable without a dedicated app just by accessing them on a mobile browser.
■ the bottom line
All of this is based on my personal experience, so I might just be very very wrong about just everything :) ... if I am, please let me know, I'm more than willing to learn!
Unfortunately, based on what I've seen, I have not clue yet where I'll end up eventually.
What a stupid thing to give up g+ instead of seeing its potential and developing it into something great!
complete agreement to your last sentence
ReplyDeleteThanks for doing this! Where I end up depends on where the rest of my interest group goes (a few thousand rpg/osr writers). Do you mind if I reshate this to them?
ReplyDeleteRichard G sure, just do as you wish :)
ReplyDeleteRe: eye candy
ReplyDeleteOne of the reasons I like G+ is because it's not crowded. Facebook & Twitter have too much going on; they are confusing. To me, eye candy is important.
One plus (no pun intended...) for a federated approach such as Pluspora (a Diaspora node) is it's feasible to set up and run your own instance. Then you control policy and all data.
ReplyDeleteMastodon and other federated networks share this characteristic. I have played with Mastodon (ronkjeffries on .social and . cloud) IMO it is more of a Twitter replacement. And its cool, but doesn't have the millions of users to SEalECTIVELY network with.
This is a great summary of your experiences.
ReplyDeleteThank you for sharing.
Ron K Jeffries yes, I totally agree. You can run your own pod or use someone elses who you might know and trust.
ReplyDeleteBut that's both an advantage and a disadvantage, because you then rely on someone elses ability to run such a service (keep it up to date, respond to threats in a timely manner, have, implement and maintain a decent backup strategy and all of that).
While I personally could do this, I am not sure that's a viable alternative for the majority of people.
Re: GDPR -- on one of the posts where the CEO of MeWe was answering questions he claimed they are hosting their servers in Ireland. I can't speak for their GDPR compliance (CEO claims they are but some have expressed differing opinions) but as a company if they continue to operate in EU then they will eventually have to become compliant (should they not already be).
ReplyDeleteAs far as I understand the GDPR, it doesn't matter where your server is located. As long as you host user data of EU/EEA citizens, you need to be compliant:
ReplyDeleteWho does the GDPR affect?
The GDPR not only applies to organisations located within the EU but also applies to organisations located outside of the EU if they offer goods or services to, or monitor the behaviour of, EU data subjects. It applies to all companies processing and holding the personal data of data subjects residing in the European Union, regardless of the company’s location.
https://eugdpr.org/the-regulation/gdpr-faqs/
eugdpr.org - GDPR FAQs – EUGDPR
Thanks!
ReplyDeleteand yes, the GDPR also applies to residents of the European Economic Area: http://www.efta.int/EEA/news/General-Data-Protection-Regulation-GDPR-entered-force-EEA-509576
ReplyDeleteOne potential alternative to Google+ that you have not mentioned, Dreamwidth, seems quite fascinating. I just signed up with them today. Apparently, they were denied service by Paypal and Google Checkout for refusing to censor content that did not violate Dreamwidth's Terms of Service, but which made Paypal and/or Google Checkout uncomfortable, only makes this SNS even more appealing (see https://dw-biz.dreamwidth.org/7022.html):
ReplyDelete> We've seen a bunch of people questioning why we don't accept
> payment via PayPal. We used to, but PayPal closed our account
> with them, after demanding that we censor our users' content to
> remove material that did not violate our Terms of Service but
> that made them uncomfortable. We refused to place restrictions
> on our users over and above the restrictions placed by US law,
> and so PayPal refused to process payments for us. (The same
> thing then happened with Google Checkout, before we found a
> payment processor that was willing to accept our business
> without placing further restrictions on user-generated content
> other than "is it legal".)
This site supports communities, and unlike MeWe, its profiles are searchable using a search engine. It has apparently been around since 1999, is based on the LiveJournal codebase (see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dreamwidth), and partly because it is not so well-known, its topics seem to be focused on actual discussion, as opposed simply to memes or gathering large numbers of other users.
Apparently, similarly to here on Google+, a circle there corresponds to a circle here.
The editing tools apparently allow the user to restrict who sees what posts, include both rich text and HTML formatting options, include a preview option and a proofreading function, and allow tags and embedded image files. They also allow editing posts after submission.
The content readership restriction tools allow the user to choose whether to display communities of which the user is a member or administrator.
Overall, the site seems quite mature in functionality. So far, I feel quite satisfied with their services.
Filip H.F. Slagter You are correct. Although it makes enforcement easier when the company has assets or income coming from EU jurisdiction. So in that sense location has some practical relevance. Imagine, for example, a Chinese social network hosting EU citizen's data and attempting to enforce compliance.
ReplyDeleteJuha Lindfors fair point :)
ReplyDeleteRe: MeWe groups, you can pin posts, they call it “featuring” though. And while you cannot apply restrictive categories like you can with groups here, hash tags used in groups appear on the right side of the group and clicking on one pulls up all posts with that tag. More work for mods, but tagging can be enforced to accomplish a similar thing.
ReplyDeleteColin Udoh Great comparisons. Pinning to G+MM.
ReplyDeleteBenjamin Russell Dreamwidth is San interesting suggestion. I believe it is based on LiveJournal code. In early Google+ days some LJ users migrated here, so DW may be a good alternative.
ReplyDeleteI've been on MeWe a week now and have received no advertisements, in app or through the email address I provided. I do not know if their website portal (if they have a website portal) has ads however. Can someone confirm?
ReplyDeleteBenjamin Russell You can definitely control who sees different posts that you make on Dreamwidth. There are public posts, Access posts which are visible to everyone that you have given access to your journal (Dreamwidth replaced "friends" and broke it into people who follow you and people you subscribe to; most of mine I both allow to read my journal and subscribe to).
ReplyDeleteThen you have custom filters, which allow you to set up groups of - hell, it's easier to call them "friends". I have filters for people I know in real life, people I know from different places, people from different hobbies, people who I trust with sensitive information...I currently have 23 different custom filters.
Also, MeWe profiles are searchable, at least through the app. On the home page is a search icon. You can search for anyone by their username, email, or phone number so long as they've made their profile searchable. So, that said, searchability is provided, but users can opt out, limiting other users access to them, sometimes unintentionally.
ReplyDeletePeter Maranci Thank you for the detailed description.
ReplyDeleteRon K Jeffries setting up your own diaspora pod would not be a great experience unless you wentbout of your way to connect to users on other pods.
ReplyDeleteThe way that federation works means that you would only start seeing hashtags from other pods when someone from your pod shared with the originating user
An explanation is reposted here
pluspora.com - For #gplus refugees and new #diaspora users i thought I'd post an e...
Very good information. Thanks for taking the time to type this all up and post it.
ReplyDelete